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powertenor
Experienced
Posts: 50
Loc: Philly
(08/25/09 07:32 AM)
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Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Just wondering if anyone has given it a go yet.
Post your results if you have. Going to give it a try on Friday.
Ian
iMac Intel Core 2 Duo 2.8GHz, OS X.4, 01X, Cubase 4, Logic 8
http://www.denolfo.com
Edited by powertenor (08/25/09 07:33 AM)
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(08/25/09 04:14 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Great question,
What I am lead to believe from friends thus far is...
you can boot SL with a 64bit kernel or with a 32bit kernel
if you boot it with the 32bit kernel, it can run both 64 and 32 bit apps and use 32 bit drivers
if you boot SL with the 64bit kernel, you can also run 64bit and 32bit apps but you have to use 64bit drivers
Macbooks with Intel graphics are restricted to the 32bit Kernel
So, thankfully... this appears to be a transitional period for Apple.
In theory, we should be able to use 1.2 on SL. Hopefully the plug-ins, SM2, the 01X editor, etc. as well. We shall see!
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(08/27/09 09:30 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
CreateDigitalMusic is doing a "Snow Leopard Watch".
http://createdigitalmusic.com/2009/08/26/snow-leopard-watch-changes-compatibility-caution-native-instruments-plogue/#more-7124
Me personally, I won't be installing it for quite some time, at least not on my regular working machine. I'll wait till the dust settles, maybe X.6.1 or something and give it a go on another HD if I'm up to it.
No need right now anyway, my MacBook maxes out at 4gb of RAM and Leopard is running very stably for me.
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(08/27/09 07:58 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
A friend of mine installed Logic 9 on SL today.
It's definitely a 32bit app, there's no alternative 64bit install on the DVDs.
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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powertenor
Experienced
Posts: 50
Loc: Philly
(08/28/09 08:50 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Was he using MLan? If so any problems? I'll get mine later, still haven't decided if I'll install yet.
iMac Intel Core 2 Duo 2.8GHz, OS X.4, 01X, Cubase 4, Logic 8
http://www.denolfo.com
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(08/28/09 11:32 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Feel free to be our test subject, powertenor.
I'll install after I hear from you it's ok. 
He was using a TC Konnekt, also a 32bit driver.
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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powertenor
Experienced
Posts: 50
Loc: Philly
(08/28/09 12:30 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
So,
Auto Connector works! (I don't ever start up MLAN the other way) Some of my plugs don't work, interestingly all by steinberg, ie.. The Grand 2, Virtual Guitarist and all of the Yamaha 01X bundled software plugs. I did have to restart my Mac after Logic 9s AU validation failed on the mentioned plugs, MLan lost connection from the plugs crashing. After restart all seems pretty normal except none of the above plugs.
I just bit the bullet and did a standard upgrade install. My Genius buddies at the store said it's the best way, ie.. don't try to start up holding the "c" key. Snow Leopard needs to run from within the OS do do all its magic.
Seems pretty snappy!
I'll post if I have any other issues.
Ian
iMac Intel Core 2 Duo 2.8GHz, OS X.4, 01X, Cubase 4, Logic 8
http://www.denolfo.com
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valmundo
Enthusiast
Posts: 495
Loc: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
(08/28/09 03:43 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
So far from what I've read online via various forums:
Cubase is not officially supported and there have been varied case studies of the software working / not working.
Logic seems to work.
mLAN - based plugins included with the 01X are DOA (and will probably stay that way if there are no further updates from Yamaha...at least as far as AU is concerned).
Autoconnector works but does that mean GP will? And what about Studio Manager.
Until I get more answers, I don't think I'll be upgrading anytime soon.
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michaelhuisman
Experienced
Posts: 62
(08/29/09 01:34 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
GP works, well, I'm connecting, but haven't run this thru any real tests yet. it's an 01x, i88x, Mo ES8 here that connect via mLAN.
it's not working any worse than the documented issues I've had moving to the 8-core Mac Pro... (in terms of connecting, I still have to power everything off between connects, but it at least holds).
I disagree big time with the Genius guys suggestion to update "in-place".
1. you need a fallback scenario. Carbon Copy Clone your startup disk to an external, *bootable* drive.
2. startup from the external drive and prove to yourself that it works and that if needed, you can use this drive to save yourself should the next steps prove out to be something you want to "undo".
3. erase your normal startup drive (remember, you have your clone...).
4. Install SL onto the new partition (the erased startup drive). After it has installed (clean), it'll ask you if you want to transfer user information, with an option to do so from another machine on your network, or a time machine backup, or... *another drive/volume on this computer*. That's the one you want - that's the clone of your original drive. It will copy over programs, files, everything you need to have a clean SL install with all your usual stuff bolted on top of that.
5. test everything under SL. if it works, save the clone drive for a week or two, just in case.
6. if SL proves problematic for you, start up from the cloned drive, erase the SL startup disk, carbon copy clone the clone back onto your original startup disk, and it's like you'll never have left home...
or you can follow the Geniuses and groan really loudly when they tell you they'll need to reinstall the base OS, you'll have to reinstall your progs and plugs-ins, and... oh yeah, we'll try and save your data....
external FW drives are cheap... no reason not to have one or more lying around for precisely these scenario's...
good luck with this!
Michael
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(08/29/09 09:19 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Michael,
Have you tried installing SM2 and the 01X editor yet?
Also, are you seeing the same with the plug-ins (pitch fix, final master, vocal rack, and the channel strip plugin)?
-----
On another note, you have to love MOTU and the way they are always on top of developments at Apple,
http://www.motu.com/techsupport/technotes/can-i-use-my-motu-hardware-with-mac-os-x-v10-6-snow-leopard-does-my-software-work-with-snow-leopard
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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michaelhuisman
Experienced
Posts: 62
(08/29/09 12:37 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
the plugs "couldn't be opened".
there are installs of SM2 and the o1x editor that came across via the transfer information from another computer method...
not tried those yet... uh... SM2 starts, o1x editor starts... wasn't able to sync with the o1x, but that may be to the fact that I route the MIDI in/out of the o1x via an i88x using regular MIDI ports thru a MOTU MTP AV... seems logical, the port (and there can only be one this way), is the Remote mode of the O1x, which *is* working btw.
I think I'll let this MacPro stay on SL. undecided on my MacBookPro as there are two pieces of gear there that aren't supported on SL (PC Expresscard eSATA interface and a PC Expresscard 3G datacard)...
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valmundo
Enthusiast
Posts: 495
Loc: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
(08/29/09 01:28 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
I wonder if it is possible to check to see if the VST version of Yami's plugins will work. It seems apparent that its AU version are DOA.
On another note, you gotta love MOTU. They are always on top of their products / drivers whenever microsoft or Apples updates their OS.
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michaelhuisman
Experienced
Posts: 62
(08/29/09 02:54 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
I can't test that here (VSTs).
In the Logic/MainStage world, these plugs weren't my go-to plugs anyway... and... I think there's an equivalent for each of these...
Yeah, MOTU seems focused on what they do (and their customers).
Michael
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(08/29/09 09:26 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Guys,
I recently did a migration when I replaced the HD in my MacBook for a larger one. It was done by installing a fresh copy of Leopard on the HD first, then migrating over firewire everything that was on my old drive.
My experience was that a lot of the Yamaha stuff had to be installed from scratch, not functioning after the migration. After doing a proper manual uninstall (as explained here on 01Xray in a bunch of threads) and reinstalling everything (including a proper install of the plug-ins from the original CD with serial number, then updating them with newest versions off of yamahasynth.com) I had everything running as it should.
The reason I bring it up is because I am thinking, Mike, that if you did a migration, you might have to reinstall some things from scratch, like I did. In which case, I am hopeful the plug-ins, SM2 and editor, and the mLAN tools all work on SL. Of course the channel strip AU/VST would be something quite valuable to make it over to SL.
-----
Have you updated your MOTU driver for SL as well?
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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michaelhuisman
Experienced
Posts: 62
(08/30/09 02:20 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
yeah, the updated MOTU driver for FW audio was posted a couple of weeks ago. works fine, is 32-bit.
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DOMZ
Regular
Posts: 11
(09/03/09 10:40 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
I installed the 1.2 drivers on my macbook pro with snow leopard and could launch logic pro 9 !! Now I'm going to try on my 8 processor G5 and let you know...
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valmundo
Enthusiast
Posts: 495
Loc: Fort Lauderdale, Florida
(09/03/09 04:21 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Snow leopard won't work on a PPC computer.
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zibba
Pro
Posts: 144
Loc: melbourne, australia
(09/04/09 04:33 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
So far in 10.6.0 from a clean install (FWIW I always upgrade cleanly).
In the mLAN Tools 1.2 installer it will fail and request you install Rossetta for the tool PlistBuddy. I didn't. So far it seems to be OK.
The driver works in 10.6.0
The Graphic Patch Bay works
Studio Manager 2 fails to launch with an error in the QT library. (That'll teach 'em for not writing native apps!).
Yet to install Logic, the MOTU drivers (who insist on still using StuffIt, fools) and the Yamaha plugs.
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zibba
Pro
Posts: 144
Loc: melbourne, australia
(09/04/09 09:02 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Update:
SM2 v2.1.3 with 01X Editor v2.2.0 is now working
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(09/05/09 06:21 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
That's 2.3.1, right? Yeah, of course.
Zibba, did you wind up installing Rosetta?
Although, I think SM2 and the 01X editor were made UB a while back.
This is pleasant news... if you can get the drivers running stably and SM2/Editor works, the plugs are not an end of all things.
This just further supports the idea that this would be any easy tweak for Yamaha engineers. It would be nice if they updated the mLAN package for SL. A 64bit version would be even more impressive.
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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archa
Newcomer
Posts: 5
(09/05/09 02:15 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Is it safe to upgrade then? I have MacPro 8 and LogicPro8. Most of the time I am working at 96kHz
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zibba
Pro
Posts: 144
Loc: melbourne, australia
(09/05/09 06:13 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Elmer: no Rosetta installed. PPC is purged from my system and I don't need it to come back. Yes 2.3.1 and the Editor from yamahasynth.com
I'm not entirely sure why it wasn't working the first time, it might have been because I hadn't installed the 01X Editor and/or partially/accidentally recovered some apps from Time Machine. Either way, I reinstalled 2.3.1 again and the companion 01X Editor now it works. I've only done cursory testing, as in, it loaded and sync'd the settings from the 01X into the SM2.
Plugs not yet tried still need to get Logic installed or buy the 9.
Re: 64-bit. There are two aspects to this. A 64-bit Kext (driver) and 64-bit app. The 64-bit driver requires the 64-bit kernel which is currently (artificially?) prevented from running on anything but the XServe and Mac Pro. However, that should be fairly easy for them to re-compile. But unlikely to happen IMHO.
64-bit apps - not to be confused with Windows here, but you can run 64-bit apps on top of the 32-bit Snow Leopard kernel. Not fully certain, but that would require they use Cocoa which at the moment they're not, they're using QT. That's a big update.
64-bit plugs - this requires a 64-bit host app (Logic, Cubase, etc) for which none currently exist. Again, not to confuse 64-bit plugs with 64-bit audio. CoreAudio I think still has 32-bit audio buffers, and why wouldn't it.
Yamaha should really release a point update to fix the PPC plist installer in the mLAN tools, a version 1.2.1 would suffice to make it less of a perceived blocker. But this problem also exists in other softwares, for example, the Office 2008 CD installer for which there's a Terminal method of installing which gets around the need for the PPC detection part.
archa: Take the necessary precautions first.
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archa
Newcomer
Posts: 5
(09/06/09 12:35 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Probably its better to get new hard drive and install SL and then test it from there.
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Kojak Black
Newcomer
Posts: 2
(09/12/09 02:24 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
I installed snow leopard last night and (phew!) everything still works. No problems at all with mLAN Auto Connect, so I can still use my O1X. Logic 9 is fine, as is Guitar Rig 3.
I'm glad I did the upgrade.
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Jore
Regular
Posts: 22
(09/12/09 11:45 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Did you do upgrade or clean installation ?
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konc3pt.sF
Enthusiast
Posts: 215
Loc: .:BaY.:CA.:Area:.
(09/16/09 09:57 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
everything seem to work fine with live 8
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Kojak Black
Newcomer
Posts: 2
(09/16/09 01:54 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
It was an upgrade. I just put the disk in and let everything happen. I was surprised by how little software I then had to update to get everything up and running as before - little snitch and 1password etc., but not much else. All my music software worked just fine from the start.
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Jay-
Newcomer
Posts: 4
(10/03/09 01:55 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
I had to use Rosetta and its working.
Im new to this!
What is going on with drop outs?
What do I record with? 48hrz or 96hrz?
The logic 9 demo project also was skipping but I messed around and it no longer skips.
However my project has drop outs on both audio in/out.
Thanks!
Hay its working for me!
10.6/logic 9!
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(10/03/09 08:25 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Work at 44.1 or 48k.
Please describe your entire setup:
What computer, what OS, what version of mLAN driver?
And what are you doing when you see drop outs?
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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Jay-
Newcomer
Posts: 4
(10/04/09 04:56 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
I'm TOTALLY good now.
I think the machine was set at 96hrz.
Back down to 48 and it appears ok.
Actually its working great!
OSX86 on a gigabyte UD3P (I paid for Mac software)
Logic 9
4 gig ram
5TB HDD.
mac_mlan_v120_e
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powertenor
Experienced
Posts: 50
Loc: Philly
(10/04/09 03:51 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
I am noticing that everything works fine as long as I don't change audio apps too much. If I switch to iTunes and listen to a song sometimes the Input of the 01X will stop working. No notice that it stopped but if I try to record from one of the 01X inputs there is no signal. I can still play audio from Logic and iTines though so output is still active. Only way to recover the input is a restart. Could be that my iTunes is on a firewire hard drive and since the iMac only has one firewire bus maybe that is causing the dropout. ISOCH channel crap. I would love to not have iTunes on a firewire drive but as my whole family uses the same computer it's the only way to share an iTunes library with all the user accounts. Oh well.
iMac Intel Core 2 Duo 2.8GHz, OS X.4, 01X, Cubase 4, Logic 8
http://www.denolfo.com
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HappyHarryNET
Experienced
Posts: 72
Loc: NASAV_studios, USA
(10/07/09 03:29 AM)
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Meanwhile... Not Losing Any Sleep
i think this 10.5 to 10.6 is a bunch of nonsense. whereas Yamaha bought Steinberg in 2005 and now flood the market with MOTIF_XS, CubaseAI4 and USB prowness using MOTIF_XS as a remote controller and VST instrument, you'd think they would immediately get their loyal Apple mLAN customers up to speed in order to continue using their legacy hardware products such as 01X, which as far as i am concerned is far from legacy hardware compared to the rest of the JUNK offered as I/O solutions for DAWs. to keep the peace i left my 01X mLAN setup on 10.5.8, but i think it all worked better on 10.5.6 ;;scratching head;;
meanwhile, i am truly enjoying dedicated recording on a AW4416 with Y56K that i recently bought brand new in the box. i must admit, it is relaxing to have the computers turned OFF during record and mix-down sessions. i miss some of Logic's magical "make me sound better" plugs, but enjoy the linear aspects of recording and mixing music.
having the Y56K onboard the 4416 with 8_side chains each having 5_blocks of FX is a wonderful addition to recording. the Waves has already added a level of quality to my music to the point i would never want to revert to not using it. also, its hardware, which is nice.
back to Mac. if things don't iron out in the coming 6 months of 2010, i will revert to a budget XP box and consider Cubase. my MOTIF_XS has both USB and mLAN advantages that when connected via Mac are not even getting used. actually, setting up XP mLAN was easier than Mac and had it not been for Elmer_Fudd, i may never had sorted that out.
my thanks to everyone at 01Xray who have supported me.
HHNET
OSX58/SL|09MacBook|Logic9|AW4416|Y56K|01X|ARTV3|RodeNT1A|MOTIF_XS|VoiceLive2|Ibanez_2012
Edited by HappyHarryNET (10/07/09 03:31 AM)
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ElmerJFudd
Guru
Posts: 3653
Loc: USA
(10/07/09 06:10 PM)
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Re: Meanwhile... Not Losing Any Sleep
X.6 is an important update for Apple's future, as is Windows 7 for the PC users. The benefits are not immediately noticeable to most end users, as it will take some time for all software and plugins to make the jump to 64bit. It is in Yamaha's best interest to lay the ground work for 64bit drivers on both the Mac and PC platform. Clearly they saw this when they started development of XP64 mLAN drivers. It really can not be that difficult for them to do a point release of their 32bit drivers for Snow Leopard and Windows 7. However, finishing work on 64bit drivers may be something they are leery to release for hardware they no longer sell. We can hope.
Harry, when you say, "if things don't iron out in the coming 6 months of 2010, i will revert to a budget XP box and consider Cubase... setting up XP mLAN was easier than Mac." I can't say I agree with that entirely, budget PCs have headaches of their own. The XP forum is rife with people having mLAN issues due to incompatible chipsets and PCI bandwidth issues, just to name a few.
White MacBook '09 (4gb RAM), OSX.5.8, v.1.2 mLAN tools, Logic 9, 01X, S90ES, i88x & i88x
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jay01xmlan
Newcomer
Posts: 2
(10/26/09 08:52 PM)
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Re: Meanwhile... Not Losing Any Sleep
Hello everyone,
I’ve been through most of the posts regarding mLan running under Snow Leopard and I’m trying to see if I have the facts straight…
Drivers:
It appears that various people have said that the mLan driver does work under Snow Leopard, but I’m wondering...has it been verified that everything works just as it did under Leopard (OS X 10.5)? (By “work” I mean with full functionality, not just that it seems to launch without an error.) In particular, back in the day, the drivers suffered from the famous “random offset” problem. Yamaha finally re-wrote the drivers to fix that, but has anyone verified that the random offset is still fixed under Snow Leopard (e.g., verified by doing the loop-back test)? I was just wondering if some change in Snow Leopard may have caused the random offset issue to rear its ugly head again.
Plug-ins:
I think the consensus is that the 01x Channel Module, Final Master, Pitch Fix, and Vocal Rack do not work under Snow Leopard, true? Did someone find a way to get these to work under Snow Leopard? (I seem to recall reading that somewhere, but I’m not sure where.)
Auto Connector & Graphic Patchbay:
These do work fully under Snow Leopard, true?
Studio Manager:
This does not work under Snow Leopard, correct? If not, has anyone been able to find a way to get it work?
If anyone could answer the questions above I’d really appreciate it. I’d like to upgrade to Snow Leopard, but have been holding off primarily because of uncertainty about how the mLan stuff would work. It would certainly be nice if the plug-ins all worked, but as long as bi-directional DAW control and audio I/O works well (without random offset), I don’t think the plug-ins are a deal breaker. (I’ve got Logic Studio 2 which has plenty of plug-ins to cover things like Pitch Fix, Final Master, etc.) Thanks in advance!
Jay
P.S. Elmer, are you ever going to take the Snow Leopard plunge? :-) If not, why not? (What are your main concerns?) Just curious...
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HappyHarryNET
Experienced
Posts: 72
Loc: NASAV_studios, USA
(10/27/09 04:54 AM)
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re: XP box & Cubase
Elmer, in hindsite i surely could agree with you. The new firewire driver for MOTIF_XS and both MacOS and PC works pretty well. Now you can use the XS as a VST in Cubase and also have full access to XS Editor on screen which is a plus.
as for the XP box, i will prolly scrap that idea too cuz my PC boxes are all old. besides OSX 10.5.8 works fine and the Cubase4/5 USB driver also works well using the XS as a controller to Cubase, including total recall and settings save via Studio Connections.
so i'm hunkering down with OSX 10.5.8 for the time being, but SnowLeopard was notably faster when i checked it out after installing.
HHNET
OSX58/SL|09MacBook|Logic9|AW4416|Y56K|01X|ARTV3|RodeNT1A|MOTIF_XS|VoiceLive2|Ibanez_2012
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jay01xmlan
Newcomer
Posts: 2
(11/28/09 10:23 AM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Bump :-)
Elmer (or anyone else who knows) if you'd be so kind, please take a look at my previous post (from Oct. 26) and let me know which parts are correct (or not correct) in that post.
Thank you very much in advance for your help.
Jay
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HappyHarryNET
Experienced
Posts: 72
Loc: NASAV_studios, USA
(11/28/09 12:49 PM)
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Re: Any Developers try Snow Leopard?
Although i was able to use Logic 9 with Snow Leopard with 01X via Graphic Patchbay that ElmerFudd helped me with, I had problems too. My 09 polycarbonate white MacBook with 4GB RAM has trouble with 01X. it took me a couple days to troubleshoot a dead fader #4, turned out the 01X needed a factory hard reset. but i believe Snow Leopard and Graphic Patchbay (mLAN) caused it.
As much as I love Snow Leopard and its improved speed, I enjoy the compatibility of 10.5.8 using Logic 9 with 01X.
If they can fix it, fine. If not, I am grateful that I am able to use 01X, Logic 9 and MacOS. It's the best!
HHNET
OSX58/SL|09MacBook|Logic9|AW4416|Y56K|01X|ARTV3|RodeNT1A|MOTIF_XS|VoiceLive2|Ibanez_2012
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